3 misfeeds on last outing

[k_semler]

Last weekend when I went shooting, I had 3 rounds misfeed, and get hung up on the bullet ramp, or jam into the underside of the barrel.  Since I fired off 120 rounds, that would be about a 2.5% failure rate.  The misfeeds cleared fine, but what would cause this?  Would it have been a dirty weapon to cause this?  When I got home, I cleaned the hell out of it, using 125 patches to get it clean.  Was this an issue with cleanliness, or is it something else?  It is a SAR-1, and I am using BrownBear SP ammunition.  One thing I noticed, there was a peice of wood in my reciever when I cleaned it out.  I still don't know where it came from, but it was in the rear of the reciever.  

Will a dirty rifle cause mis-feeds like it does in the AR, or is there something else wrong with the rifle?  Granted, 2.5% failure rate isn't that big of a deal, but I won't tolerate that rate of failure on my computer (now 99.9714% uptime), so why should I put up with it with a weapon when it may very well cost me my life?  That's the reason I bought an AK, I wanted reliability.  If I wanted a rifle I had to be miticulous about, I would have bought an AR!

[Onepoint]

Surely your are mistaken.  I have it on good authority AKs never fail.  :P

I would guess its mag related 1st.
Look at the feedlips on the mag and see if they are bent more on one side or one end, I had a SAR-1 fail to feed and it was mag problems.  The bullets were not raising high enough and were being over run by the bolt and catching on the ramp.  Cycle it slowly by hand and watch where the bolt hits the shell case.

Its possible the mag is dirty and sticking, or has a weak spring too.

[Lollygagger]

While there have been reports of poor mag placement in the SARs causing problems as you note, I would suspect YOUR AMMO choice.

It is NOT that your ammo is BAD...

It is just that the AK was designed as a military weapon...to use BALL AMMO (FMJ). In other words, the designer did not concern himself about sporting round use (why would he?).

The effect is, the soft lead tips of the SP ammo drags on the mag front, the bullet guide, and, the dinged/soft tip can resist chambering.

So? What to do?

(1) You can live with it.

(2) You can avoid SP use (it usually is more expensive anyway -and not much of a performer due to steel copper plated jackets usually being used).

Or...

(3) (The BEST choice)...get the bottom of the chamber mouth chamfered & radiused between 7:00 to 4:00 with no more width at the bottom than 4mm (45 degree angle) and, polished.

This can be done with a Dremel. It is not unlike what is done to a 1911 barrel throat to facilitate HP use.

ALL my AK weapons (save the .308 that is differently set-up) are so modified. They have had no FTF since.

Lollygagger  :wink:

[k_semler]

While there have been reports of poor mag placement in the SARs causing problems as you note, I would suspect YOUR AMMO choice.

It is NOT that your ammo is BAD...

It is just that the AK was designed as a military weapon...to use BALL AMMO (FMJ). In other words, the designer did not concern himself about sporting round use (why would he?).

The effect is, the soft lead tips of the SP ammo drags on the mag front, the bullet guide, and, the dinged/soft tip can resist chambering.

So? What to do?

(1) You can live with it.

(2) You can avoid SP use (it usually is more expensive anyway -and not much of a performer due to steel copper plated jackets usually being used).

Or...

(3) (The BEST choice)...get the bottom of the chamber mouth chamfered & radiused between 7:00 to 4:00 with no more width at the bottom than 4mm (45 degree angle) and, polished.

This can be done with a Dremel. It is not unlike what is done to a 1911 barrel throat to facilitate HP use.

ALL my AK weapons (save the .308 that is differently set-up) are so modified. They have had no FTF since.

Lollygagger  :wink:

So I do this on the bullet ramp?  Could I do this with the file on my multi-tool?  Or do I need to buy a dremel?  I could use an air-grinder, but that would be a little bit of overkill.   So why did it only do it about every 40 rounds, and not more frequently?  I thought the ejection angle from the magazine was a consistant?

[k_semler]

Surely your are mistaken.  I have it on good authority AKs never fail.  :P

I would guess its mag related 1st.
Look at the feedlips on the mag and see if they are bent more on one side or one end, I had a SAR-1 fail to feed and it was mag problems.  The bullets were not raising high enough and were being over run by the bolt and catching on the ramp.  Cycle it slowly by hand and watch where the bolt hits the shell case.

Its possible the mag is dirty and sticking, or has a weak spring too.

It couldn't have been the mags.  When I got them, I took them apart and they were all fine.  I had one magazine that had a f-ed up spring, (it was caught on its self), but I fixed that.  The mags are perfectly normal, and the lips are in the normal position, (at least they appear to be, I don't see any plier marks on them).  

I have a bullet that was a misfeed with a scrape down the side with a f-ed up projectile end, I can put up a picture of it if you want.

[Lollygagger]

So I do this on the bullet ramp?  Could I do this with the file on my multi-tool?  Or do I need to buy a dremel?  I could use an air-grinder, but that would be a little bit of overkill.   So why did it only do it about every 40 rounds, and not more frequently?  I thought the ejection angle from the magazine was a consistant?

NOT the ramp/bullet guide...

The CHAMBER...the back, rear, bottom of such -the "throat" or "mouth" -if you choose.

It will require a Dremel-like tool...overkill is BAD, as metal does not go back on easily.
If you are unsure of this -get it done by someone experienced in such.

The reason the problem is not consistent is that the effect on "drag" by the soft lead, and sometimes deformed in the process, tipped SP...is NOT consistently the same.

Here...


This is a SKS that I did the chamber on to enhance feed with SP & HP, the econcept is the same. I re-touched the blue on the polished chamfer, so it is not appearing brite.

Lollygagger  :wink:

[Onepoint]

I would try cycling some FMJ like Lolly says before I did anything to mod the rifle.  If the lead tip is deforming a lot before it gets to the chamber, it means its not feeding well, if there is scrapes along teh case its more of a pick up problem in feeding.

 If the shell is being dragged along because it hit and the bolt over rode it, it may still be the mag isnt inserted far enough.  You have to see when the shell is slipping off the bolt face.  If it was just the bullet hitting the ramp,  it would hold the bolt open.  Its hard to figure it out without watching it cycle.

It sounds like from the description that its feeding off the mag, hitting, the momentum is push the shell down in the mag far enough to slip off and then dragging it half way to the chamber.   If it quits with FMJ, you can polish and reangle some of the places the bullet rides against including chamber face to help, but dont get carried away.

[wera276]

I would say take a different mag with you and burn up the rest of that ammo you have.  If tit don't jam......you know it was the mag.  If it still does, try some different ammo, FMJ or HP with a hard tip.

[Lollygagger]

I would say take a different mag with you and burn up the rest of that ammo you have.  If tit don't jam......you know it was the mag.  If it still does, try some different ammo, FMJ or HP with a hard tip.

TRY FMJ, period...

The HP can have some snag & drag problems as well -just not as much as SP.

Lollygagger  :wink: