Author Topic: Bomb shelter under existing house slab?  (Read 3646 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

will52100

  • SKS Marksman
  • ***
  • Posts: 174
Bomb shelter under existing house slab?
« on: January 14, 2011, 07:57:42 AM »
http://www.ssrsi.org/Onsite/ultimate_hobby.htm  Some interesting reading, but would love to read his manual, but understand he passed away a few years ago.  Not sure if I want to dig a hole in my slab, but I would like to read on his constructions methouds.  Half way around the world need something to engage my mind.  Still think I'm going to put an above ground atached to the house this summer though, but being hidden would be real nice.

Anybody got any more info on the guy or his bunker?

Thanks

ranger1968

  • Site Owner
  • Administrator
  • SKS Guru
  • *****
  • Posts: 23212
Re: Bomb shelter under existing house slab?
« Reply #1 on: January 14, 2011, 10:49:24 AM »
 Seems like an interesting idea...I am not sure how it would affect the structural integrity of the slab, and the idea of a single person doing thick poured concrete walls using bags of cement is a little difficult to envision.....

  I couldn't do it here, you start hitting water and limestone rock at about 6-7 feet.

   If you are going to do an outbuilding of some sort, it would be relatively easy to dig out the ground and build a shelter, or bury a large culvert pipe or a steel container for use as a shelter, and then pour the slab for the outbuilding over it, leaving some type of top access into the floor of the out building... you could also excavate a trench and place a length of pipe in it leading to the house, and emerging somehere inside for use as a connecting tunnel.

  Just some ideas....
Proudly making the world a safer place, one dirtbag at a time....

captain concrete

  • Board Supporter
  • SKS Guru
  • *****
  • Posts: 3039
Re: Bomb shelter under existing house slab?
« Reply #2 on: January 14, 2011, 03:09:17 PM »
concrete slabs need a solid base throughout or they WILL fail and crumble rather quickly. no cheating or getting around that... it will happen. so id highly advise not to cut a hole in a slab and try to tunnel it out.

as for pouring anything using "sackcrete"... have fun. i did 3 sidewalk squares for a buddy because he already bought the material and it took over 20  80lb bags...lol. not saying it cant be done, but unless you have 200 egyptian pyramid builders, i dont see it happening :lol:.

im basing my opinions on 17 years concrete experience, so take it as you may.
I am the 'AMMO HOARDER EXTRAORDINAIRE'  :-)

ranger1968

  • Site Owner
  • Administrator
  • SKS Guru
  • *****
  • Posts: 23212
Re: Bomb shelter under existing house slab?
« Reply #3 on: January 14, 2011, 03:20:57 PM »
 Thanks for clearing that up, Captain Concrete, I was afraid it would undermine the slab. :(

  And as for pouring the walls by hand using bags,  :shock: I'm with you, that's crazy, I've also done small projects with 80 lb bags, and you always use WAY more than you think you will need. :lol:
Proudly making the world a safer place, one dirtbag at a time....

captain concrete

  • Board Supporter
  • SKS Guru
  • *****
  • Posts: 3039
Re: Bomb shelter under existing house slab?
« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2011, 04:29:14 PM »
yeah, it sounds neat to have an underground bunker... but it has to be engineered out and done properly or it could be very dangerous. ive done a few "underground" houses before and when you do the concrete roof or "cap", its usually over a foot thick with a couple rebar mats on 6" centers throughout... pretty costly. the last one i helped on, i remember the homeowner complaining that he'll have spent $80,000.00 just on the concrete foundation before he ever actually uses a piece of lumber... so i know its out of my price range. as ranger1968 suggested, maybe some sort of large steel culvert would be a fairly cheap idea. i know they get all of 15' diameter and probably bigger. if you put one in on a hillside you could seal off one end and have the open end looking out over the hillside area. probably be pretty well self-insulating also.
I am the 'AMMO HOARDER EXTRAORDINAIRE'  :-)

will52100

  • SKS Marksman
  • ***
  • Posts: 174
Re: Bomb shelter under existing house slab?
« Reply #5 on: January 14, 2011, 04:57:54 PM »
Thanks, I'm realy more interested in it as a mental exercise.  And while I say bomb shelter, I'm realy more interested in being a gaurd against anouther Katrina, and a safe room while I'm overseas for a month at a time.  That said, I've done a good bit of concrete work myself and trust me, I fully understand what 80 sacks are like.  On the other hand in my job I have moved and emtied 6,000 pounds of 100 pound sacks of chemicles in a day.  Not that I want to repeat it.  Anouther concern is that personaly I think most of the quickcrete out there is on the weak side and I have to add portland to it.  My slab is 5" thick at the thinest, which when you run the numbers means a 7' span with little to no safty factor.  A max 6' span would work.  Also as long as you stay 4-6' from the outside of the house the center is non load bearing.

Again, this is a curiosity and it's bugging me to learn more about what he did and how he did it.  If I can get the time this summer I'm going to add on to the house with an above ground "bunker" and brick it to look like just anouther room on the house.  Slightly more expensive, but probably way better in the long run, and definatly easier to build.

captain concrete

  • Board Supporter
  • SKS Guru
  • *****
  • Posts: 3039
Re: Bomb shelter under existing house slab?
« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2011, 01:23:19 AM »
the above ground brick room sounds much better. and im not trying to imply  im all knowing... cause im not... but please dont undermine an existing slab. it just wont work. span ratings are meant for new construction under specific conditions, not demo and "re-work" projects. anyhow... enough of my speech... im outa here 8)
I am the 'AMMO HOARDER EXTRAORDINAIRE'  :-)

will52100

  • SKS Marksman
  • ***
  • Posts: 174
Re: Bomb shelter under existing house slab?
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2011, 01:58:05 AM »
No worries, and I just finished my house and got moved in, the last thing I want to do is tear up the floor!  Not to mention I personaly don't like the idea of getting squished, or almost as bad haveing my house damaged or destroyed. 

I was hoping someone had read his pamplet, or knew where I could find a copy.  What little TV I watch is "how it's made" and such shows.

Now if I had it to do over, I'd have put a basement in and designed it to handle the loads, but I wasn't making much money at the time.  It took 3 years after pouring the slab to start framing up.  Took a little longer this way, but it's paid for.  Now I'm running into things I wish I'd known then, or had done differant.

Thanks

Hillbilly61

  • SKS Guru
  • **
  • Posts: 3547
Re: Bomb shelter under existing house slab?
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2011, 10:43:28 PM »
Yea, the slab being hollowed out underneath & then cracking/collapsing would be my biggest worry. My 2nd biggest worry would be why the house is on a slab to begin with. I know that this is the norm in many parts of the country, but in some of those parts it is necessary as the water table is too high. Dig a "basement" and it fills up with water. Not good if you need a sump pump running 24/7 and totally incompatible with SHTF since power to run the pump will be limited or nonexistent.

will52100

  • SKS Marksman
  • ***
  • Posts: 174
Re: Bomb shelter under existing house slab?
« Reply #9 on: January 17, 2011, 10:31:18 AM »
The main reason is cost, its cheaper to do a proper slab foundation than a proper sub floor.  And at the time I didn't have a lot of money.  If I had I would have put one in then.  Water table isn't an issue, I'm on a hill on fairly high ground.  If I had it to do over I'd do an earth sheltered, but again at the time I didn't have the money.

Rite now I'm looking at fiberglass storm shelters, thinking of adding one and pouring a slab around it on the back, then posibly later walling it in as a spare room with access to the shelter.

Goran

  • SKS Sniper
  • *****
  • Posts: 546
Re: Bomb shelter under existing house slab?
« Reply #10 on: January 22, 2011, 12:21:45 AM »
Recently on one of the History channels they had a story of a man who build a bomb shelter under his house that was 4 1/2 stories below ground. He was an engineer and it took him 14 years. It is located on the border of WA state and Canada.

http://www.mypnw.us/stuff/Interesting/Interesting.nukehome.aspx

http://www.canadianchristianity.com/cgi-bin/bc.cgi?bc/bccn/0105/04blast

The links is good reading. I plan on doing something similar.

will52100

  • SKS Marksman
  • ***
  • Posts: 174
Re: Bomb shelter under existing house slab?
« Reply #11 on: January 22, 2011, 04:18:53 AM »
That's who I'm talking about, would love to know more, and especialy if his "brochure" is still availible.  Was interesting reading, thanks.

jlwilliams

  • SKS Gunsmith
  • *
  • Posts: 1532
Re: Bomb shelter under existing house slab?
« Reply #12 on: January 22, 2011, 07:54:50 AM »
deleted
« Last Edit: March 07, 2011, 11:53:09 PM by jlwilliams »

will52100

  • SKS Marksman
  • ***
  • Posts: 174
Re: Bomb shelter under existing house slab?
« Reply #13 on: January 22, 2011, 09:34:39 AM »
Big trick is to keep the neighbors or Town Hall from knowing what you are up to.  Nothing wrecks an emergency shelter like too many people

That's what's good about living in the country, I'm 45min from the nearest large town/city.  And no building codes!

Lone Eagle

  • Board Supporter
  • SKS Guru
  • *****
  • Posts: 5252
  • Well, is it?
Re: Bomb shelter under existing house slab?
« Reply #14 on: January 22, 2011, 11:48:49 AM »
Just pull out all the stops and buy a missile silo.

http://www.silohome.com/
Μολὼν λαβέ (Molon labe), “Come and get them!”

AK-47--So Simple a Caveman Could Fix One